A Possible player's Road-Map...


  • FOUNDER: DUKE

    Hi everyone
    Today, during my LOOOONG car-travel, i got time to think about what i like and what i dislike about this game and could be done to improve it and put it more casual-player friendly

    WARNING: WALL TEXT EMERGENCY, i will try to summarize for points

    1- BLESS SCROLL AND PVP: about pvp, i think this game is still in a alpha state, because actually there is no possibility to do a true pvp, because attacking someone put u red, with an incredible bunch of malus with not a real motivation. Pk is part of the game, and yes its for hard-core player who choose the renegade way, getting pursued by all players and playing always in guard mode, but the actual rules just try to discourage that way (that is the most beautiful imho). Actually does not exist alignment and factions (if they ever will exist), but i think the present situation only put malus on loser and to reward for winner, because the bless system allow rich to keep safe its armor and weapons, while the poor noob will always lose all he got. Pk generally keep under control boss areas so they control at same time the most proficient rare bless scroll drop points, except other ones hard to keep under control, but will speak about it apart.
    I think who kill deserve a reward, and a money reward could be a good point, so i suggest the introduction of the INSURANCE system who Ultima Online experienced long-time.
    People insure his items (price increase with item value), when he die, a part of that money go automatically to winner, part will be lose. So we have for sure a reward and a penalty.
    But i wish to go on, and banish ANY king of bless scroll, except for RBS, that will be used ONLY on artifacts... WHY?? Simple, people that cannot farm bosses, but can use craft skills to get money, will allow themselves to come in battle with at least a blue armor set insured, giving him a good chance to play, enjoying, without the thought that he could lose some charge of bless scroll that he cannot easily regain, putting him out of pvp for days probably...
    But what change with artifacts? they cannot be insured, but only blessed, and who kill a player with artifact will get money as an insured item, while the loser will lose a charge, and if is going out of charge, can remove artifact before losing it, and use blue weapon to continue enjoy the pvp.

    2- DETERIORATION OF ITEMS. I think the most incredible and stupid thing of the game is the deterioration system of the items that bring armor and weapons to slowly destroy themselves unless u don't pay real money to keep them alive (yes REAL MONEY, does not exist another way to keep item alive forever), but this system automatically created a ladder of builds that cost more or less:

    • Mage with martial arts and alteration and spiritualism
    • Mage with martial arts and alteration
    • Mage with staff and spiritualism
    • Mage with staff
      -Archer with spiritualism
    • Archer
      -Macer with spiritualism
      -Macer
      -Severing warrior with spiritualism
      -Severing warrior

    This is a ladder where top build could cost 0 real money because can be played without any item and so nothing to repair, while bot build is technically the most expensive because both armor and weapon will deteriorate fastly. (ladder could not be exact but the sense i think its clear)
    This will limitate greatly the freedom of choice of the builds of the characters because of the proper wallet.
    How to resolve this issue, there could be more ways....

    • Allowing to craft or get repair tool with in-game dinamics(not the simple repairer, but this who re-increase the top durability)

    • Introducing a NEW MODIFIER: INVULNERABILITY. This modifier is rare and can be rolled with the crafting set of the quests (that increase the skill level), or bye drop in chest lvl 90 or more or boss drop. An entire set of invulnerability item will allow player to never lose durability of his armor and weapon so he don't need to spend money, but at same time he lose 1 modifier per item (1x6 for armor plus weapon) that will not give him some real advantage like resistance, accuracy and more. But this could create a world of indestructible items along the time, so i thought that this items could lose durability ONLY when player die (like 10-20% of the durability), not by the use of the items

    • PROSPECTING AND MINING. Mining will be clearly a support skill for blacksmith, but prospecting, from what i read in these days, seems will be thought as a partial support of mining. I don't like so much this idea, because prospecting need an identity, a rule, actually seem a passive bonus for other craft skill, and this is sad. Chain bonus are good ideas, but let the skill to have a proper utility, or people will skill it ONLY to have a larger area for mining.
      My idea is: more proficient treasures, with exclusive items for the realm and even some minor artifact maybe; with mining, the possibility to get some gems too from mineral veins (intended as a plus); with lock picking, possibility to get treasure chests locked

    -REALMS: games force point should be the realm system, but actually he failed totally imho, for several reasons: Claim stake has been declared to 1 week "to prevent people colonize forever good points,if they leave game, spot will be free faster", total false.... In these days i logged in ALONE (1 player online during about all day) and the entire volcanic area is still colonized by realms that never disappear, because the owner (who will be? :P ) refresh continuously them, keeping the area under control and limiting greatly the game for newcomer that hardly will farm philosopher stones of will try Tartaros.
    Here my solution, structured in several steps:

    • Claim stake of 15 days or 1 month purchasable by credits from banker
    • Possibility to turn the proper realm into a "FRIENDLY REALM", where everyone can mark location (only inside the realm, not on the environment around), and teleport, this should limitare the greed of certain areas allowing people to enjoy the realm they prefer in jungle or desert.
    • Possibility to turn the proper "personal bank", into a public bank, allowing duke and princes to create little cities on the map, forging the world with proper hands.
    • Introducing the CUSTOM VENDOR, to allow people sell what they want by him choosing price and stock dimension

    -SPIDER DUNGEON. This dungeon is used to farm money, jewel and skill up lock picking, but actually its not designed for a populated server, because its a solo dungeon that last 1 hour, with no boss. I suggest to create another spider dungeon, to create 3 range of level for locking and difficulty (spiders on map should have 3 different color, green, yellow and red). And more, when cool down start killing a spider, the entrance should collapse blocking inside the character/s, re-opening itself at the end of dungeon (a lvl 100 mining could allow to re-open the entrance for pk, sounds funny :P )

    Here my ideas, i'm ready to get lapidated, show me your mercy or cruelty :D



  • Yay, it's actual constructive thread. I'ma shit all over it.

    1. Blless Scrolls and PVP

    The Assassin system right now has very. very trivial punishments. I suspect the only reason most people aren't assassins is that you won't be able to go back later when Prom decide to change values.

    Rewarding PKers inherently makes the game less casual-friendly, unless the proposed insurance system is so cheap as to make the rewards/losses meaningless. Additionally, I would point out most artifacts are incredibly weak right now; eight being useful at all, six sharing three slots,and the two being out-preformed by good rolls on random gear. A vast majority of the powerful items are already generated through crafting/skills, and it would seem crafting is getting another buff soon if the roadmap is still accurate.

    1. Deterioration of Items

    Durability isn't directly what you're discussing here. Nobody likes that repair kits are for real money, nobody likes that whales have extreme economic control in some areas, not even the Devs. It's better than the alternatives, though. Without some way for whales to indirectly buy power, or god forbid, directly buy power, the value of credits will decrease to nothing and Prom/Urial/Artistguy won't be able to eat. I mean they will, but not as a result of the effort they put into LR.

    The current system is very much top-down, in the sense that end game players buy credits off of new players, and new players don't need credit items. I suspect all of your suggested solutions/alternatives would near completely remove demand, with no alternate cash flow for the devs being suggested.

    1. Realms

    I'd again dislike the current interaction of claim stakes, but as stands, they serve the same function as repair kits from a real life monetary perspective. From the context of the game, however, they're incredibly vital to the econemy. They're the only thing stopping hyperinflation, in fact they're the only reason Argents have ANY value at all. I suspect most people would prefer the Argent dump/s be elsewhere, but especially with F2P there need to be limiting factors on realm ownership.

    "Friendly Realms" already exist, it's just that human interaction is a prerequisite. I've teleports to every noteworthy location on the map, including inside of generally hostile player's realms. Allowing this kind of mechanic to exist without interaction/deals/trades would be removing content, not adding it.

    1. Spider Dungeon

    I would argue the spider dungeon/s work perfectly well in a populated realm. Having the reliance on resist jewels being mostly removed by recent crafting updates, spider dungeons are purely an end game farming area. I think most people would agree areas that are purely for end game players should be heavily contested.


  • FOUNDER: DUKE

    @Holya said in A Possible player's Road-Map...:

    Yay, it's actual constructive thread. I'ma shit all over it.

    1. Blless Scrolls and PVP

    The Assassin system right now has very. very trivial punishments. I suspect the only reason most people aren't assassins is that you won't be able to go back later when Prom decide to change values.

    Rewarding PKers inherently makes the game less casual-friendly, unless the proposed insurance system is so cheap as to make the rewards/losses meaningless. Additionally, I would point out most artifacts are incredibly weak right now; eight being useful at all, six sharing three slots,and the two being out-preformed by good rolls on random gear. A vast majority of the powerful items are already generated through crafting/skills, and it would seem crafting is getting another buff soon if the roadmap is still accurate.

    1. Deterioration of Items

    Durability isn't directly what you're discussing here. Nobody likes that repair kits are for real money, nobody likes that whales have extreme economic control in some areas, not even the Devs. It's better than the alternatives, though. Without some way for whales to indirectly buy power, or god forbid, directly buy power, the value of credits will decrease to nothing and Prom/Urial/Artistguy won't be able to eat. I mean they will, but not as a result of the effort they put into LR.

    The current system is very much top-down, in the sense that end game players buy credits off of new players, and new players don't need credit items. I suspect all of your suggested solutions/alternatives would near completely remove demand, with no alternate cash flow for the devs being suggested.

    1. Realms

    I'd again dislike the current interaction of claim stakes, but as stands, they serve the same function as repair kits from a real life monetary perspective. From the context of the game, however, they're incredibly vital to the econemy. They're the only thing stopping hyperinflation, in fact they're the only reason Argents have ANY value at all. I suspect most people would prefer the Argent dump/s be elsewhere, but especially with F2P there need to be limiting factors on realm ownership.

    "Friendly Realms" already exist, it's just that human interaction is a prerequisite. I've teleports to every noteworthy location on the map, including inside of generally hostile player's realms. Allowing this kind of mechanic to exist without interaction/deals/trades would be removing content, not adding it.

    1. Spider Dungeon

    I would argue the spider dungeon/s work perfectly well in a populated realm. Having the reliance on resist jewels being mostly removed by recent crafting updates, spider dungeons are purely an end game farming area. I think most people would agree areas that are purely for end game players should be heavily contested.

    1- Insurance cost is relatively cheap (i thought about 1000-1500 for a blue item, so every kill should reward for about 7-8k silver with a player with full blue set), and this should be the principal way to spend argent, not claim stacks only.. YES, artifact should be redesigned to be more impressive into my idea, not just a bit different from craft, and obviously dungeons to get them should require a TEAM, not a solo player trivial

    2- the money staff need should arrive from other ways, not from core features, otherwise it's clearly a pay to play. I think with a more structured claim-stake system (more time, stackable, etc) should allow to get more cash from this side instead from durability, and obviously improving aesthetics items that in other games allow the entire sustainibility of servers

    3- friendly interaction is incosistent of populated servers, actually to invite a friend , i have to invite one by one all his characters (it's not an account bind), think this on a really populated server, it' really imposible to contact singularly everyone and invite them, and think that if your claim should disappear, at your re-claim, friend list reset..... My system allow to everyone who want to come and shop in my realm by my merchants, using my personal bank and farming around being grateful to me even if i don't know them

    4- i always thought spider dungeons was for skilling lockpicking, but sure they are a good farm area, but u cannot say it's for expert player, because it's a solo dungeon that actually everyone can manage alone, even a noob like me. And more i think they are not well strunctured now, just think how difficult is to get a key from spinners (i got a 6 kill straight line and no drops), while on great spider cave drop rate is more balanced and even the dungeon is faster than the easy version, and MORE, chests inside the dungeons are not proportioned to the difficulty (in the easy one, there are more chest lvl 80 than 70, while in the advanced one, there are still chests lvl 30.....). Surely there is some work to do on, and more after your exploit with chest lvl 100



  • @Meziljin

    insurance
    I don’t think many people know all of the farming methods, or use anywhere near effective builds. The difference between farming effectively and not in Linkrealms is MASSIVE. To put it in perspective, actively farming I can make an average of ~2.5M/hour. If we’re only counting straight currency/the most liquid of assets(RBS, Pstones), I can make ~1.4M/hour. Purely from macros/afk(without breaking the rules), however, I can make ~540k/day – and that number is going to skyrocket into the tens of millions once F2P in introduced.

    The economy very much needs to be balanced before the insurance system is added. No price right now would both discourage high end players, and be casual/new player friendly. There are absolutely no rewards from PVP by comparison to normal farming, as everybody has previously discussed, but a healthy economy is far more important right now.

    However, I would argue that a single death’s worth of insurance for a new/poorly geared player should be worth at least 10 minutes, and a near BiS laden character’s worth at least an hour.

    The money
    I've watched a lot of interviews about payment models with developers, and the consensus seems to be purely cosmetic cash shops make almost nothing, unless the player base is massive. Like League of Legends/Team Fortress/Counter Strike massive. I have seen maybe 3 people using cash shop cosmetics in Linkrealms, but every single person I play with has used at least 200 item repairs to date.

    It seems the game is full of whales too, as I've never had trouble buying accounts/founder packs/cash shop items off of other players. The price of a credit has stuck around 2k, this is in part due to the poor economic knowledge of these whales, but also because most of the time the economy is flooded with credits to the point they devalue themselves.

    I hate that repairs are cash shop items, but it's by far the most elegant solution I can think of. Also props to Proemtheus for not adding the credit vendor. I never would've let any of you poor fucks buy a repair kit again.

    Open Claims
    I understand your point, but I don't think it fits the themes/objectives of Linkrealms. I mean, markets/banks I'm indifferent, or in favor of, but making one's realm friendly to all I am not. Firstly, that would be a griefer's haven. Within a week of it being introduced nobody would use it, because they're sick of me camping them, and any system put in place to stop me would have negative effects on regular PVP.

    Secondly, a large part of the appeal of this game, I feel, is the small community and forced interactions. Not necessarily positive interactions, but forced. It's the same argument millions have had about LFD/LFR in WoW, or the grand exchange in Runescape. It’s convenience versus forcing meaningful interactions. I believe the developers, and to some reasonable extent the community would prefer thematic/meaningful interactions over convenience.

    Spider Dungeons
    You are correct, the spider dungeon without the level 100 chest is completely irrelevant. The greater spider cave, however, is definitely for high end players. It drops, to my knowledge, the best jewellery in the game, with jewls being the first, or second most important slot depending on your build. They’re also probably the most time slot to have perfect pieces in. I mean, I’m not sure how much they buffed the drop rate on good jewls, but it was by far the hardest and probably still is.

    I’d definitely be in favor of rebalancing the lesser spider dungeon, but strongly opposed to anything that would make the great one less contested. It’s one of the very few truly meaningful nodes in the game. On an aside, any dungeon in the game can be fairly efficiently soloed by a completely naked character without healing items. Content difficulty isn’t a great way to determine who a dungeon is for.


  • FOUNDER: DUKE

    @Holya said in A Possible player's Road-Map...:

    @Meziljin

    insurance
    I don’t think many people know all of the farming methods, or use anywhere near effective builds. The difference between farming effectively and not in Linkrealms is MASSIVE. To put it in perspective, actively farming I can make an average of ~2.5M/hour. If we’re only counting straight currency/the most liquid of assets(RBS, Pstones), I can make ~1.4M/hour. Purely from macros/afk(without breaking the rules), however, I can make ~540k/day – and that number is going to skyrocket into the tens of millions once F2P in introduced.

    The economy very much needs to be balanced before the insurance system is added. No price right now would both discourage high end players, and be casual/new player friendly. There are absolutely no rewards from PVP by comparison to normal farming, as everybody has previously discussed, but a healthy economy is far more important right now.

    However, I would argue that a single death’s worth of insurance for a new/poorly geared player should be worth at least 10 minutes, and a near BiS laden character’s worth at least an hour.

    The money
    I've watched a lot of interviews about payment models with developers, and the consensus seems to be purely cosmetic cash shops make almost nothing, unless the player base is massive. Like League of Legends/Team Fortress/Counter Strike massive. I have seen maybe 3 people using cash shop cosmetics in Linkrealms, but every single person I play with has used at least 200 item repairs to date.

    It seems the game is full of whales too, as I've never had trouble buying accounts/founder packs/cash shop items off of other players. The price of a credit has stuck around 2k, this is in part due to the poor economic knowledge of these whales, but also because most of the time the economy is flooded with credits to the point they devalue themselves.

    I hate that repairs are cash shop items, but it's by far the most elegant solution I can think of. Also props to Proemtheus for not adding the credit vendor. I never would've let any of you poor fucks buy a repair kit again.

    Open Claims
    I understand your point, but I don't think it fits the themes/objectives of Linkrealms. I mean, markets/banks I'm indifferent, or in favor of, but making one's realm friendly to all I am not. Firstly, that would be a griefer's haven. Within a week of it being introduced nobody would use it, because they're sick of me camping them, and any system put in place to stop me would have negative effects on regular PVP.

    Secondly, a large part of the appeal of this game, I feel, is the small community and forced interactions. Not necessarily positive interactions, but forced. It's the same argument millions have had about LFD/LFR in WoW, or the grand exchange in Runescape. It’s convenience versus forcing meaningful interactions. I believe the developers, and to some reasonable extent the community would prefer thematic/meaningful interactions over convenience.

    Spider Dungeons
    You are correct, the spider dungeon without the level 100 chest is completely irrelevant. The greater spider cave, however, is definitely for high end players. It drops, to my knowledge, the best jewellery in the game, with jewls being the first, or second most important slot depending on your build. They’re also probably the most time slot to have perfect pieces in. I mean, I’m not sure how much they buffed the drop rate on good jewls, but it was by far the hardest and probably still is.

    I’d definitely be in favor of rebalancing the lesser spider dungeon, but strongly opposed to anything that would make the great one less contested. It’s one of the very few truly meaningful nodes in the game. On an aside, any dungeon in the game can be fairly efficiently soloed by a completely naked character without healing items. Content difficulty isn’t a great way to determine who a dungeon is for.

    i just understood u will never be really objective, because all your points are a conflict of interest, a personal view for personal intents...

    A game opened only for whom can pay will die soon, all games of the world have a 70-80% player base with no pay transition, they just fill the game making it playable for all....
    Actually this game cost 3-4 times more than any other game similar, with no real reason....



  • @Meziljin
    I'm absolutely bias in favor of 1) increasing the population, 2) making the game hardcore, 3) anything that gives prestige to better players, in that order of importance. I don't really know what the developers want Linkrealms to be, but most of my suggestions/arguments are based on what I assume they're going for.

    I'm not sure what you're arguing in terms of the game being expensive? In the above I've pointed out I make enough Argents in one hour to pay for months worth of repairs. While I would agree you can absolutely buy power indirectly in Linkrealms, honestly, it's to a lesser extent than in EVE, WOW, Runescape, Ultima, nearly every game I can think of. Money is absolutely not an effective means to power in Linkrealms.


  • FOUNDER: DUKE

    @Holya said in A Possible player's Road-Map...:

    @Meziljin
    I'm absolutely bias in favor of 1) increasing the population, 2) making the game hardcore, 3) anything that gives prestige to better players, in that order of importance. I don't really know what the developers want Linkrealms to be, but most of my suggestions/arguments are based on what I assume they're going for.

    I'm not sure what you're arguing in terms of the game being expensive? In the above I've pointed out I make enough Argents in one hour to pay for months worth of repairs. While I would agree you can absolutely buy power indirectly in Linkrealms, honestly, it's to a lesser extent than in EVE, WOW, Runescape, Ultima, nearly every game I can think of. Money is absolutely not an effective means to power in Linkrealms.

    Your consideration are really hilarious....
    With 0 population its really easy farm money, with 500 player on a server argents will not flow more, but really less, because mobs are always the same
    It's statistic impossible to farm an entire spider dungeon with a population like 500 (example) so if now i can get 30k river each round, it will be a good catch to arrive at 1k silver with a flow of player invading hot spot for gold, it's so easy to understand

    About your ways to get money, we all know ur a lamer using exploits, reasoning like its all ok, legitimating your actions, but it's not...
    Your abuse of multi-account allow u to control the entire map, so it's obvious ur against a free access to hot spots for all, because it is against your politic
    And more, how can u think people generally can spend money like you spent here?
    And more again, how can u simply think staff want to make game an hard-core model? it's exactly the opposite way they need to pursue to save the entire game, otherwise this game will fail exactly like other software house did in past with their works (for example reverie studios ....)

    I read about 40 forum and observed about the most active propaganda about this game around the world, and what people say it's always the same: Problem is you and your gameplay, not the contents of the game.... Don't believe it? i can show u linking most of the opinions around the world, but i'm sure u will ignore same, because it's not your problem right?



  • @Meziljin
    I could make millions of gold a day without any chance for other players to interact(attack), even if the server were overpopulated and every node camped by players more powerful than me. I thought that's what we were discussing, the economic problems Linkrealms has, their interactions with any possible insurance system, and potentially a means to fix it.

    You seem very emotional, irrational and generally unknowledgeable about Linkrealms/multiplayer games in general. That might just be the language barrier, though.

    how can u simply think staff want to make game an hard-core model? it's exactly the opposite way they need to pursue to save the entire game

    I largely agree a more soft-core approach is optimal here; not because soft-core games inherently get more players, they absolutely don't, but because that's what the developers want. Arguing in favor of anything else is simply a waste of time. I mentioned my order of importance for a reason, and the game being more hardcore is of lesser importance to me for a reason.

    Problem is you and your gameplay, not the contents of the game

    I'm legitimately trying to be polite, but this one a truly retarded statement. I didn't make the gameplay, I was not involved in any way in making the gameplay, I couldn't slightly shape or change the gameplay if I literally dedicated my life to it. The developers made the game, and the gameplay. A player as efficiently as possible playing the game, as the developers made it has not done anything wrong, even if they made gameplay worse for you. If you don't like the gameplay for some reason, maybe you just don't like the game.

    Anyhow, I'ma leave my macros running grabbing me Argent/gear/leveling new scouts while I go play WoW. Found so many bugs in that game it's more broken than alpha Linkrealms.


  • FOUNDER: DUKE

    @Holya said in A Possible player's Road-Map...:

    Anyhow, I'ma leave my macros running grabbing me Argent/gear/leveling new scouts while I go play WoW. Found so many bugs in that game it's more broken than alpha Linkrealms.

    Just a statement to demonstrate who you are :)
    have fun



  • @Meziljin
    Yeah, playing a game more efficiently than you, while remaining completely within the game's ruleset. Unlike a lot of other people I could mention. You're actually braindead if you think if you think this is an insult


  • FOUNDER: DUKE

    @Holya said in A Possible player's Road-Map...:

    @Meziljin
    Yeah, playing a game more efficiently than you, while remaining completely within the game's ruleset. Unlike a lot of other people I could mention. You're actually braindead if you think if you think this is an insult

    Your making my day :)
    Pls continue, how u get so many money very day? i'm so curios...



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  • Here's the new player road map I forsee...

    1. Bot until you've maxed your skills and have good gear.
    2. Go out to kill people, then realize the only active players are botting to raise their skills.
    3. Stop playing.

  • FOUNDER: PRINCE

    This post is deleted!

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