Multi-Accounting Rules - Official Discussion Thread


  • FOUNDER: DUKE

    @Holya said in Multi-Accounting Rules - Official Discussion Thread:

    @Meziljin I think the language barrier is coming into play again. i don't believe I can make you understand my point, and I've already given detailed enough examples for others.

    Will allow people to play at same condition and don't give advantage to whom have more computers at home

    High-value realms will still be monopolized, just by organizations instead of single players. Or single players who get around the rules.

    Will allow to people to play at same economic condition and don't permit people to use multiple-account to earn money meantime they enjoy other things (afk craft and sell etc..)

    People won't have the same economic conditions, in fact, there will be a larger disparity between those who multi-client and those who don't.

    Will allow people to have an active and real community and not cities full of bot or realm with characters sparring vs skeletons

    Nobody has proposed macroing be disallowed, and specifically this is something Prom has suggested might be an exception to the rule. Even if it's not, people will find a way around it.

    Will allow, substantially, to play in an honest way the game instead of your conduct....

    People could already do that if they wanted. Those people just couldn't, and still will not be able to compete.

    Maybe its not a language barrier, probably a mind barrier:

    • High-value realms will still be monopolized, just by organizations instead of single players. Or single players who get around the rules.

    -YES, the best way to compete is by cooperation, NOT single player dominate the world map, that's exactly the point

    -People won't have the same economic conditions, in fact, there will be a larger disparity between those who multi-client and those who don't.

    -This is exacly what i said :|,maybe here we have a language barrier

    -Nobody has proposed macroing be disallowed, and specifically this is something Prom has suggested might be an exception to the rule. Even if it's not, people will find a way around it.

    • I'm totally agree on this, the point is that if i leave 2 characters sparring with 2 account, and meantime i play with another account doing dungeons, if i /who, will appear a server population value 3 times bigger, falsing totally the true playing characters online. It could be read as a worthless point, but its not

    -People could already do that if they wanted. Those people just couldn't, and still will not be able to compete.

    • The fact people can do what they want doesn't mean its an honest way to play the game :)


  • If you want to be competitive in PvP Linkrealms, you need to dedicate your PC to running multiple clients 24/7. How's that for an entry barrier?



  • @Meziljin Actually your right. I said I was a vet. and I never said in any point that I was good ? So dude you really need to be smarter and think about why UO is dead now. All the you know we multi client and dont respect shit , this doesnt keep game alive


  • FOUNDER: DUKE

    @Mal i said nothing about you :|



  • @Roundwaters This turns me off so much.


  • FOUNDER: PRINCE

    @Prometheus said in Multi-Accounting Rules - Official Discussion Thread:

    @Clavicus I believe a MMO should allow you to play by yourself, but that you should need a group to defeat the greatest challenges and get the best rewards. The current monster and dungeon balancing is preventing that from happening, we are aware (will be fixed). The current extreme multiaccounting too (is being fixed). You (and the other veterans who know Linkrealms very well) are more than invited to explain why in your opinion dungeons work better soloed than with a group and propose changes to fix the situation. I haven't addressed the fact you own more than 3 realms because we are still discussing to get to a satisfactory conclusion and to a final version of the rules.

    Firstly I want to point out the population of your game. Not to be a dick. To point out that with currently ~30 people (lets see what it is if multiple accounts on at once is actually remove) the game needs to be run solo. If you start implementing 5 man dungeons like most games or 4 man like ESO how are people going to run these dungeons? There isnt enough population to do so and you will alienate solo players. If all the dungeons require multiple people to run it what are you going to implement for solo players that drops gear that is a step above crafted but a step below group? ESO has a good system where there are mini bosses that are easy for 1 player to kill that are found in "delves which are soloable" that can give you nice set pieces etc. Then you can 4 man group dungeons. They also have trials which is their equivalent of raiding.

    If you make group dungeons to where a very well and skilled player can solo it will said player want to actually do it if it then becomes too time consuming? Some of course will however you need to realize games like, for example, wow are successful because they cater to casual players while still having elements that hardcore people enjoy. Speaking for myself I was a hardcore raider in eq2 for 2 years. I worked, i went home to my second job - raiding, and I slept. Now I would still consider myself more hardcore than most but I sure as hell dont come close to what I use to be due to other obligations.

    To me you need to cater to your current population and grow it from there. The skill level for a linkrealms player is frankly extremely low. If you start implementing dungeons with actual mechanics like dodge this/cure that/yada yada most of these people will be considered ghost scouts and will deserve to be banned while running dungeons because they die so much.

    I want to be crystal clear on my position for owning more than 3 realms/having multiple characters logged in at the same time and im sure this is where my views differ substantially from Holya. In no way shape or form am I suggesting any form of automation of said account be legal EXCEPT macroing inside a player owned realm to raise skills. You should not be allowed to use a series of macros to control your character to gain loot. You should not be able to use a bot program etc etc (which is how the current ruleset is no?). Again myhal said it best when he said why make something frustrating when it doesnt have to be. Let people use multiple characters but not for the purpose of standing afk to scout and get rid of people who bot their character around looping in stealth (for example). What I worry about is someone that is legit afk or something getting some sort of ban when it is unwarranted. I also worry about the effectiveness of you being able to catch these individuals.

    On the topic of having more than 3 accounts and owning more than 3 realms I want to point out this game is called linkrealms. Realms is in the damn title. The environments that you guys create are cool as hell. Im a nerd when it comes to owning land. When the new purple areas in the pvp lands opened I freaked out and ran as fast as I could to grab one. Back pre phoenix when the pvp lands opened I was like omgwtfbbq this is cool as hell. I ran as fast as I could to claim the realm that I have inhabited for the vast majoriy its been around where the tart entrance is. I owned all the pre phoenix realms that had teleporters in them. Like 6 pvp realms at least... and a few realms that had the banks in them. Being able to build as many different types of houses I want and have them simultaneously built, for me, is awesome. I spend a lot of time replicating things more creative people than I are able to build like my current realm by tart which is directly modeled after the old lizzogoth area that was dormant in the mushroom part of the pre phoenix map.

    Also Id like to point out while almost all these dbags stopped playing LR before early access I was the one spending my rl money snapping up what I consider good locations around the game. Monitoring them every morning or evening running the map checking to see if a new spot had fell (and fu myhal for claiming your realm back i saw it fall and was going to claim it but at the time didnt wanna run out and was like nobody will claim then u did jerkface) This is why it pisses me off so much that there is AT LEAST no grandfather system being implemented (again id rather there be no limitation and yes I realize that makes the buy extra character slot basically worthless but never understood why u were so eager to implement it anyway). The grandfathering is fair imho due to the fact that every single player who has a account currently gets to take part. If you dont want to pay for multiple realms then dont thats your choice.

    The main problem in my view with this conversation is you have a vast majority of people who are butthurt by Holya who think this will magically stop them from getting owned by him like somehow it will diminish his pvp skill set/or make them good? (and I really hate ever having to refer to him like he in some way shape or form is an end all be all of anything). He will still have access to x number of realms (as will anyone else who chooses to work with people to get friended to their realms etc) and will freely be able to move around the map and scout like LDK winter beta. That kid literally teleported from UFO realm to UFO realm looking for people to kill (i do not have an issue with this just stating a fact and making a point). Also what if I have my 1 character on and all I do is sit in a dungeon and wait for someone to run it then murder them at the boss? My point exactly.. it....will.... still.... happen.

    The other people in this thread are like roundwaters and have a certain perception from the fourms/rely heavily on basically what only Holya says when he makes these grand statements which may situationally be true but dont come close to being completely accurate and comment on issues they know nothing about like "If you want to be competitive in PvP Linkrealms, you need to dedicate your PC to running multiple clients 24/7. How's that for an entry barrier?" Then some random comments "this turns me off so much" and thus gives a negative connotation to have multiple accounts and utilizing multiple characters when it couldnt be further from the truth.

    Im an advocate for fair play. By no means does having multiple accounts above 3 and more than 1 character logged in constitute unfair use or give another player a distinct advantage/disadvantage when using them within what I consider an acceptable ruleset. We all want the same thing in that we want scouting to go away. My proposal which was brief and you (prometheus) may have never viewed because it was around the time you disappeared and went on vacation but it was to make dungeons more like the UO Dreadhorn boss (http://www.uoguide.com/Dread_Horn) See the sections with Keys if you are unfamiliar with it. You can gather said keys to gain access which have a timer on them for expiration. I dont want to see a quick bandaid or an "easy way out" implementation on this issue liek you simplifying the assassin ssytem from what was originally intended or ghost scouting which some people thought would magically solve them being able to run dungeons. I want something substantial and concrete while not being radical like imho your proposed solutions.

    You need to focus on the root cause (trolollol thats for you frostee/amused although I know you would never read this wall of text) Population being low is one factor (1 person can effectively be a killing machine with such a low pop/people who are undergeared and the world is relatively small). Not being able to effectively find someone botting/using a series of macros to farm is another (which according to you will be implemented soon?) It being to easy to spy a dungeon/static location is another.

    I hope you read this entire post I know its lengthy and didnt mean to post a big ass wall of text but thats how it goes sometimes.



  • @Clavicus
    The above is predominately a better argument than mine. I'm more arguing for the competitive crowd, a crowd that doesn't really exist yet in Linkrealms to a large degree yet. For an average player, the effects of this change will be exactly:

    • PKers will attack you somewhere between exactly as much, and very slightly less

    • It's going to be somewhere between much harder, or not at all harder depending on how the rules are enforced to get tailoring/lockpicking gear

    • The value of credit items(claim stakes, portals) will go slightly down

    • You will need to be in a large guild with active players to get a teleportation network. Or talk to people. Disgusting.

    • Might wanna be suspicious of the new guy in the guild trying to get you to gank Hades all of the time, 'cause he's probably trying to get you banned

    • Most importantly, small groups/solo players will be at a much bigger disadvantage(although the increase of advantage only really applies to people who likely would've had an advantage regardless, so it probably won't change the outcome of many encounters)

    From the perspective of somebody who's legitimately trying very, very hard to be the best, versus somebody who is the same in every way, this change is massive. If they continue to scout, level the best new build faster than us, get those extra 2% sp, 3% cp, 5% resists on their bracers faster than us, and try to prevent us from getting them at all by controlling nodes we simply cannot beat them. If it would've been 50/50 if both of us scout, or neither of us scout, it'd be 95/5 if one did, and one did not.



  • nice and interesting arguments, ill trow my cent in.

    I belive that as a spiritual succesor of UO lockpiking should be on other char designed for treasure hunting, like it was on UO
    on the other hand the 1 acount loogued limit is kinda weird, if you want to limit the dungeon scouting them move the dead player to a resurection spot out of the dungeon after 10 minutes
    most of the time 2nd account is used to move items between chars on the same acount or to help on training skills, who does not used the 2nd acount as sparring ;D

    well live long and prosper and continue the great work!


  • FOUNDER: DUKE

    @jymnils said in Multi-Accounting Rules - Official Discussion Thread:

    on the other hand the 1 acount loogued limit is kinda weird, if you want to limit the dungeon scouting them move the dead player to a resurection spot out of the dungeon after 10 minutes

    IIRC, the current timeout for moving a dead player out of a dungeon is 5 minutes, and it does not seem to have been very effective in preventing the current scouting problems. Plus you can get around it by having some throwaway alt with decent hiding & stealth to do the AFK Scouting anyway.



  • @Prometheus
    It seems this thread is somewhat dead, without much being resolved from my perspective. It's predominately been criticism, without any solutions. In order of how happy I'd be with the change, here are the potential sets of solutions I'd be okay with.

    Potential solution 1) Make scouting not economically viable

    • All characters who die in PVP with a while risking under X amount, or preferably just all characters who die in PVP have their ghosts spawn in Riverbank, with a short penalty that disallows teleportation.

    • A minimum amount of risk(blessings) be required to a be allowed to use Hide for any noteworthy amount of time, after which the hider begins taking damage, or is teleported to Riverbank. This would preferably be disabled during the dungeon collapse phase.

    • Increase the effectiveness of anti-stealth mechanics, especially on non-moving targets. Increasing the range of reveal, and or decreasing the cost of the revealy wand would likely achieve this.

    • No other new rules.

    The hope for this change is to encourage players to actively hunt scouts, and it be profitable to do so. I would absolutely hunt other people's scouts if I got to steal 20k Argents or so per, and I'm completely sure others would do so to me. This solution requires any scouts people are using to be actively played, which would be roughly as effective as walking between dungeons/nodes, if not less so.

    Potential solution 2) Scouts no, playing alts yes

    • Allow a preferably infinite, but at least 5 characters(main, lockpicker, crafter, dummy, leveler) online within the safe zone/player owned realms simultaneously.

    • Allow multiple characters to be played in PVP enabled nodes exclusively when they're collapsing(Lizzgoth Maps, Greater Spider Cave, Green Dungeon), with an optional limit of two characters/player.

    This would leave scouting in essentially the same state as your current implementation of the rules, but leaves production predominately the same. Given, one could macro Gnomer/Hades very easily before, but I don't think many people actually did that - and with the drop rates being as high as they are not, not being able to do it myself wouldn't bother me.



  • usually soloers need a second acount online for training or resurection, we should add resurection to the magic book as 9 grade spell and maybe a weapon or artifact, like resurecion staff, first aid kits or something. been killed on a dungeon and have to run all the way having firiends near you is kinda weird ;D

    the resurection item/spell wil come handy olso, if you not resurected on 120 seconds you go teleported outside the dungeon or to main city, the 120 seconds counter activates again if a dead char enters a dungeon.



  • There used to be a resurrection skill that summoned 4 cherubs. Back when spiritualism was largely useless.


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